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	<title>Comments on: &#8216;VA Death Book&#8217; and Other Health Care Issues</title>
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	<link>http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/2009/08/va-death-book-and-other-health-care-issues/</link>
	<description>bilge (noun)- worthless talk or writing; nonsense</description>
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		<title>By: Richard</title>
		<link>http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/2009/08/va-death-book-and-other-health-care-issues/comment-page-1/#comment-468</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Sep 2009 16:01:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/?p=1223#comment-468</guid>
		<description>This is what happens when people don&#039;t read any more of the story than the headline. It&#039;s the press&#039;s job to inflame opinion and stir outrage with distorted views and rumormongerers for sources, sex, lies and video, that&#039;s what sells. Sometimes you can even find the real story buried within the article if you bother to read that far. Then there are these political agendas, it seems everyone wants our President Obama to look bad so that they can say, &quot;I told you so&quot; Hey, we elected the guy, now I say work with him, not against but that will never happen. Good job with this blog in debunking the slime coming from the bilge.

By the way, I am a former Marine, disabled from the VN war and I recently had a living will done for me at the Carl T. Hayden VA medical center in Phoenix, AZ and I couldn&#039;t have been treated any nicer. The guys that helped me were all former vets and vets look out for vets. As long as we have these caring people around it&#039;s ok for them to be realistic about our choices. Semper Fi</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is what happens when people don&#8217;t read any more of the story than the headline. It&#8217;s the press&#8217;s job to inflame opinion and stir outrage with distorted views and rumormongerers for sources, sex, lies and video, that&#8217;s what sells. Sometimes you can even find the real story buried within the article if you bother to read that far. Then there are these political agendas, it seems everyone wants our President Obama to look bad so that they can say, &#8220;I told you so&#8221; Hey, we elected the guy, now I say work with him, not against but that will never happen. Good job with this blog in debunking the slime coming from the bilge.</p>
<p>By the way, I am a former Marine, disabled from the VN war and I recently had a living will done for me at the Carl T. Hayden VA medical center in Phoenix, AZ and I couldn&#8217;t have been treated any nicer. The guys that helped me were all former vets and vets look out for vets. As long as we have these caring people around it&#8217;s ok for them to be realistic about our choices. Semper Fi</p>
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		<title>By: Matthew LoFiego</title>
		<link>http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/2009/08/va-death-book-and-other-health-care-issues/comment-page-1/#comment-464</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew LoFiego</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Aug 2009 17:56:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/?p=1223#comment-464</guid>
		<description>Mr. Malley, thank you for providing excellent insight into the workings of the panel and a clarification of what was shelved.  I appreciate you taking the time to share your information.  
The most important part of the email to me was the title alone, and the implications that are held within.  An email subject stating that the President is pushing veterans towards euthanasia is a bit too much, given the fear being spread around.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. Malley, thank you for providing excellent insight into the workings of the panel and a clarification of what was shelved.  I appreciate you taking the time to share your information.<br />
The most important part of the email to me was the title alone, and the implications that are held within.  An email subject stating that the President is pushing veterans towards euthanasia is a bit too much, given the fear being spread around.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Malley</title>
		<link>http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/2009/08/va-death-book-and-other-health-care-issues/comment-page-1/#comment-463</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Malley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Aug 2009 16:44:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/?p=1223#comment-463</guid>
		<description>Please allow this comment on your post.  I am the President of Aging with Dignity, the non-profit organization founded by Jim Towey.  I was also a member of the 18-member panel set up by the VA to look at “Your Life, Your Choices” after he and I voiced our concerns to the VA in September 2007 after seeing the revised version, published June 11, 2007.  Few people have seen this version – it was the one the Bush administration saw and shelved.  It is twice as long and just as bad as the 1997 version.

The issue isn’t whether Mr. Steele or Rev. Klingenschmitt think “Your Life, Your Choices” goads veterans to commit suicide, it is the way these important discussions are to be framed in the first place.  This is important because if the approach YLYC advocates is made the norm, it could have a major impact on the lives of all, not just veterans and retired military officers.  

First, note that both the original 1997 YLYC and the revised 2007 YLYC direct people seeking an advance directive to only one resource: a pro-assisted suicide non-profit organization (Choice in Dying, formerly the Euthanasia Society, and Compassion and Choices, formerly the Hemlock Society, respectively).  The VA can’t and doesn&#039;t deny that fact.  To point that fact out is not to suggest that the VA is urging veterans to commit suicide, it is to point out the unshakeable bias of the author, Dr. Pearlman, and the fatally flawed nature of his and his team of authors’ approach to advance care planning.  

It is not only what the document says, it is what isn’t said or offered.  The quality of life check list starts with the choice of “difficult but acceptable” and then declines to “not worth living.”  Where is the positive option?  When you frame the discussion in this fashion, you corner people with bad choices. You are not allowing them to say, “I can derive love and joy from life even if I am in a wheelchair or can’t control my bowels. Here’s what you can do to help me live my life to the full.” YLYC does not provide an option for people to say, “I have been taking care of others my whole life and now I am in need of care – I will accept that this is my situation and try to love my caregivers and try to contribute to the lives of my children or grandchildren as best as I can.” People aren’t urged to say, “I am frightened by the fact that I can’t go outside anymore – I want my family and friends to visit me and engage me so that I can live as full of a life as possible.” Many people with disabilities live meaningful and beautiful lives even if they are in a nursing home or need help from others.  This was one of the main points made by Jim Towey in his criticism of YLYC.

Second, read the literature of the assisted suicide movement.  It treats dependency as a terrible thing and its proponents project their own feelings onto others (“I wouldn’t want to live if I were ever in that condition!” or “I can no longer bear my loved one’s suffering so I wish he/she would die.”). The assisted suicide point of view of Dr. Pearlman measures the value of life in terms of autonomy, control, independence and utilitarianism, as opposed to a belief set that holds life as having inherent dignity and not diminished one bit by incapacity.  YLYC casts the debate in “quality of life” metrics of “being a burden” and “depending on others” and “my life won’t return to normal” and does not make any effort to allow people to say: “Here’s what I need to help me live a meaningful life if I have had a stroke or can’t even shake the blues.”  This obsession with death is something that no health system should embrace, certainly not one supported by taxpayers and used by our veterans.

Aging with Dignity is an advocate for respect for life at all its stages and for better and dignified care at the end of life.  Jim Towey created Five Wishes to allow people to state in their own words what kind of care they want or don’t want in case of serious illness or impending death.  

Finally, know that many individual VA facilities have used Five Wishes, which is why he thought to pay them a visit in September 2007.  He had not even heard of YLYC until he was given a copy of the June 2007 version.  We immediately raised concerns and the VA later pulled both versions.  Case closed, or so we thought.  It was only when YLYC was revived in July 2009 that he spoke up.  This puts to lie the line that he was somehow disgruntled over the VA not choosing to adopt Five Wishes.  Why wait two years?  The he’s-just-disgruntled story line is a way to avoid speaking to his central point.  It&#039;s good that Sen. Specter and Rep. Buyer have called for hearings into YLYC.

I hope you continue this discussion.  It is too important to be written off as just more Democrat-Republican politics as usual.  I would be happy to send you the June 2007 version in PDF; you can read it and decide for yourself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Please allow this comment on your post.  I am the President of Aging with Dignity, the non-profit organization founded by Jim Towey.  I was also a member of the 18-member panel set up by the VA to look at “Your Life, Your Choices” after he and I voiced our concerns to the VA in September 2007 after seeing the revised version, published June 11, 2007.  Few people have seen this version – it was the one the Bush administration saw and shelved.  It is twice as long and just as bad as the 1997 version.</p>
<p>The issue isn’t whether Mr. Steele or Rev. Klingenschmitt think “Your Life, Your Choices” goads veterans to commit suicide, it is the way these important discussions are to be framed in the first place.  This is important because if the approach YLYC advocates is made the norm, it could have a major impact on the lives of all, not just veterans and retired military officers.  </p>
<p>First, note that both the original 1997 YLYC and the revised 2007 YLYC direct people seeking an advance directive to only one resource: a pro-assisted suicide non-profit organization (Choice in Dying, formerly the Euthanasia Society, and Compassion and Choices, formerly the Hemlock Society, respectively).  The VA can’t and doesn&#8217;t deny that fact.  To point that fact out is not to suggest that the VA is urging veterans to commit suicide, it is to point out the unshakeable bias of the author, Dr. Pearlman, and the fatally flawed nature of his and his team of authors’ approach to advance care planning.  </p>
<p>It is not only what the document says, it is what isn’t said or offered.  The quality of life check list starts with the choice of “difficult but acceptable” and then declines to “not worth living.”  Where is the positive option?  When you frame the discussion in this fashion, you corner people with bad choices. You are not allowing them to say, “I can derive love and joy from life even if I am in a wheelchair or can’t control my bowels. Here’s what you can do to help me live my life to the full.” YLYC does not provide an option for people to say, “I have been taking care of others my whole life and now I am in need of care – I will accept that this is my situation and try to love my caregivers and try to contribute to the lives of my children or grandchildren as best as I can.” People aren’t urged to say, “I am frightened by the fact that I can’t go outside anymore – I want my family and friends to visit me and engage me so that I can live as full of a life as possible.” Many people with disabilities live meaningful and beautiful lives even if they are in a nursing home or need help from others.  This was one of the main points made by Jim Towey in his criticism of YLYC.</p>
<p>Second, read the literature of the assisted suicide movement.  It treats dependency as a terrible thing and its proponents project their own feelings onto others (“I wouldn’t want to live if I were ever in that condition!” or “I can no longer bear my loved one’s suffering so I wish he/she would die.”). The assisted suicide point of view of Dr. Pearlman measures the value of life in terms of autonomy, control, independence and utilitarianism, as opposed to a belief set that holds life as having inherent dignity and not diminished one bit by incapacity.  YLYC casts the debate in “quality of life” metrics of “being a burden” and “depending on others” and “my life won’t return to normal” and does not make any effort to allow people to say: “Here’s what I need to help me live a meaningful life if I have had a stroke or can’t even shake the blues.”  This obsession with death is something that no health system should embrace, certainly not one supported by taxpayers and used by our veterans.</p>
<p>Aging with Dignity is an advocate for respect for life at all its stages and for better and dignified care at the end of life.  Jim Towey created Five Wishes to allow people to state in their own words what kind of care they want or don’t want in case of serious illness or impending death.  </p>
<p>Finally, know that many individual VA facilities have used Five Wishes, which is why he thought to pay them a visit in September 2007.  He had not even heard of YLYC until he was given a copy of the June 2007 version.  We immediately raised concerns and the VA later pulled both versions.  Case closed, or so we thought.  It was only when YLYC was revived in July 2009 that he spoke up.  This puts to lie the line that he was somehow disgruntled over the VA not choosing to adopt Five Wishes.  Why wait two years?  The he’s-just-disgruntled story line is a way to avoid speaking to his central point.  It&#8217;s good that Sen. Specter and Rep. Buyer have called for hearings into YLYC.</p>
<p>I hope you continue this discussion.  It is too important to be written off as just more Democrat-Republican politics as usual.  I would be happy to send you the June 2007 version in PDF; you can read it and decide for yourself.</p>
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		<title>By: Matthew LoFiego</title>
		<link>http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/2009/08/va-death-book-and-other-health-care-issues/comment-page-1/#comment-461</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew LoFiego</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Aug 2009 13:07:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/?p=1223#comment-461</guid>
		<description>Not sure what the June directive was, but I&#039;m assuming you mean the July one, which is linked in the first sentence of the &#039;Specific Exaggerations&#039; section.

Here is the direct link to the update:  &lt;a href=&quot;http://www1.va.gov/VHAPUBLICATIONS/ViewPublication.asp?pub_ID=2042&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www1.va.gov/VHAPUBLICATIONS/ViewPublication.asp?pub_ID=2042&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not sure what the June directive was, but I&#8217;m assuming you mean the July one, which is linked in the first sentence of the &#8216;Specific Exaggerations&#8217; section.</p>
<p>Here is the direct link to the update:  <a href="http://www1.va.gov/VHAPUBLICATIONS/ViewPublication.asp?pub_ID=2042" rel="nofollow">http://www1.va.gov/VHAPUBLICATIONS/ViewPublication.asp?pub_ID=2042</a></p>
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		<title>By: Mike</title>
		<link>http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/2009/08/va-death-book-and-other-health-care-issues/comment-page-1/#comment-460</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Aug 2009 00:53:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/?p=1223#comment-460</guid>
		<description>Funny you link to all these directives, but not the June 2009 directive.  Hmmmmm.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Funny you link to all these directives, but not the June 2009 directive.  Hmmmmm.</p>
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		<title>By: katherine /leon akinsa,sr</title>
		<link>http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/2009/08/va-death-book-and-other-health-care-issues/comment-page-1/#comment-459</link>
		<dc:creator>katherine /leon akinsa,sr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Aug 2009 00:35:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/?p=1223#comment-459</guid>
		<description>to mr secor and mr doolys statement-evidently you have not read HR 3200 and are not over 50 years old and have wealth enough to buy,fly to england /germany for your medical emrgency by the best.By the way ALL OF CONGRESS JUST VOTED THMSELVES OFF THE required Health Reform 3200 should it pass.We as millions of seniors will be &quot;counseled to help us end our unproductive and social seurity medicare sucking life. We the millions who have either worked or served in the military and are intelligent enough to have  aided or added to  this USA highly industrialized,NASA,entrepreneural,inventive,technology which we all benefit from,not to mention the millions who sarificed their lives so we could be free,proudAND WAVE OUR AMERICAN FLAG. OUR &quot;PRESIDENT ELECT?&quot; took off USAIR 1 and aplogized for our arrogance to other contries which is unamerican and despicable FRANCE would not be(we liberated them)thousands of our troops are there inmultiple cementeries.woul be good if the protesters to the protesters might read some history and constitutions rights blood stained.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>to mr secor and mr doolys statement-evidently you have not read HR 3200 and are not over 50 years old and have wealth enough to buy,fly to england /germany for your medical emrgency by the best.By the way ALL OF CONGRESS JUST VOTED THMSELVES OFF THE required Health Reform 3200 should it pass.We as millions of seniors will be &#8220;counseled to help us end our unproductive and social seurity medicare sucking life. We the millions who have either worked or served in the military and are intelligent enough to have  aided or added to  this USA highly industrialized,NASA,entrepreneural,inventive,technology which we all benefit from,not to mention the millions who sarificed their lives so we could be free,proudAND WAVE OUR AMERICAN FLAG. OUR &#8220;PRESIDENT ELECT?&#8221; took off USAIR 1 and aplogized for our arrogance to other contries which is unamerican and despicable FRANCE would not be(we liberated them)thousands of our troops are there inmultiple cementeries.woul be good if the protesters to the protesters might read some history and constitutions rights blood stained.</p>
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		<title>By: rita stanfield</title>
		<link>http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/2009/08/va-death-book-and-other-health-care-issues/comment-page-1/#comment-458</link>
		<dc:creator>rita stanfield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Aug 2009 00:11:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/?p=1223#comment-458</guid>
		<description>So it&#039;s come to this , our vet&#039;s who served our country must be evaluated as to their self worth, if you feel no self worth and you want to die we will help you out.What is happening to America? Our vets fought to keep us safe, are we going to tell them just make a decision to live or die. I love the men and women that fought for our county and I just want to tell them they have a life until God comes to take them home. We cannot make their decisions for them. This hand book sends and underlineing message. Vetrains of america, you still have a life , we love you.
God Bless America</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So it&#8217;s come to this , our vet&#8217;s who served our country must be evaluated as to their self worth, if you feel no self worth and you want to die we will help you out.What is happening to America? Our vets fought to keep us safe, are we going to tell them just make a decision to live or die. I love the men and women that fought for our county and I just want to tell them they have a life until God comes to take them home. We cannot make their decisions for them. This hand book sends and underlineing message. Vetrains of america, you still have a life , we love you.<br />
God Bless America</p>
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		<title>By: katherine /leon akinsa,sr</title>
		<link>http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/2009/08/va-death-book-and-other-health-care-issues/comment-page-1/#comment-457</link>
		<dc:creator>katherine /leon akinsa,sr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Aug 2009 23:45:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/?p=1223#comment-457</guid>
		<description>please send me updates thank you</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>please send me updates thank you</p>
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		<title>By: COACHEP &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Posts about Obama Health Care Failure as of August 29, 2009</title>
		<link>http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/2009/08/va-death-book-and-other-health-care-issues/comment-page-1/#comment-455</link>
		<dc:creator>COACHEP &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Posts about Obama Health Care Failure as of August 29, 2009</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Aug 2009 21:35:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/?p=1223#comment-455</guid>
		<description>[...]  [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...]  [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Ray Dooley</title>
		<link>http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/2009/08/va-death-book-and-other-health-care-issues/comment-page-1/#comment-454</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray Dooley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Aug 2009 21:27:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.moaablogs.org/battleofthebilge/?p=1223#comment-454</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t get this at all, how could anyone reading the source documents come to a euthanazia conclusion.  Sad how far the propaganda has gone.  How are people falling for this?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t get this at all, how could anyone reading the source documents come to a euthanazia conclusion.  Sad how far the propaganda has gone.  How are people falling for this?</p>
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